14bux
Senior TF2 Admin
The problem is we own 600+ guns. It's hard enough to sell them as it is.
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Does gun control work?
- Thread starter swan
- Start date
Xilorator
Blackpulse Admin
Mad man, you guys must have committed several thousand murders with those awful shooty thingys
excalibur
DARKLY Regular
Xilorator
Blackpulse Admin
Since bullets are in high demand, just give them away with every thousand rounds you buy hahaha
$alvador
TD Member
Of course gun control works, how else are you gonna learn how to aim?
In all seriousness though, I think Canada's got a pretty good approach with restricting handgun purchases while allowing rifles and shotguns. All these thugs running around shooting at each other on the street are armed with handguns you can't even legally buy here and if they get caught with a piece and there's a ballistics match they're locked up for a decade to life as they should be. Just the other day there was an armed robbery on the street near Jane & Finch for a fucking cell phone. I shit you not. I go to fucking school there with 30k other people. If it's not bad enough to be reading articles about the terrorists in training sitting next to me now there's anarchy in the damn street.
I don't like the idea of CCW because there's nothing you can do against a criminal who has the element of surprise to his advantage. What are you really going to do with that .45 in your pocket when there's a gun unexpected in your face other than hand it over to the criminal with the rest of your shit? Sounds pretty fucking dumb to me
In all seriousness though, I think Canada's got a pretty good approach with restricting handgun purchases while allowing rifles and shotguns. All these thugs running around shooting at each other on the street are armed with handguns you can't even legally buy here and if they get caught with a piece and there's a ballistics match they're locked up for a decade to life as they should be. Just the other day there was an armed robbery on the street near Jane & Finch for a fucking cell phone. I shit you not. I go to fucking school there with 30k other people. If it's not bad enough to be reading articles about the terrorists in training sitting next to me now there's anarchy in the damn street.
I don't like the idea of CCW because there's nothing you can do against a criminal who has the element of surprise to his advantage. What are you really going to do with that .45 in your pocket when there's a gun unexpected in your face other than hand it over to the criminal with the rest of your shit? Sounds pretty fucking dumb to me
excalibur
DARKLY Regular
you don't exactly keep a .45 in your pocket that would be a large pocket. At least for my .45, if you have it concealed he wouldn't even know you had it so you still have more surprise than he does. I like my chances are getting my gun up and shooting him in the very least in the leg before he can even react to my movements. If you learn how to use and conceal the weapon correctly you should always have the upper hand to a criminal. Practice, practice, practice and not just shooting.
Xilorator
Blackpulse Admin
People that CCW are genuinely responsible with firearms, if you don't like another person having a CCW then get one yourself. Just because you don't use your right doesn't mean someone else shouldn't be able to use it. If you fear a criminal having a CCW, don't worry call the cops. They are only 5 minutes too late.
$alvador
TD Member
Sounds like a lot of stress to constantly walk around in public ready to whip out your piece and shoot someone. Then there's the legal rammifications that will follow if the police thinks the circumstances were ambiguous. Honestly, what fucking situation do you imagine you would even get into in public to actually NEED a handgun on your person? Seems like paranoia without cause
Xilorator
Blackpulse Admin
Well I can think of a lot of places that you would need one, but seeing as you more than likely live in a low crime area I can understand why you may not be inclined to own a gun. You should want to own a gun to protect your love ones from harm, even if you don't carry it around. It's being responsible even if it is unlikely that you would never use it. Same reason you buy insurance, to ensure that if something does occur then you are covered or prepared.
People that CCW more than likely don't carry their weapon/s all the time. More than likely if they know where they are going is a higher crime area or is more dangerous, then they would probably carry it. I live in a nice neighborhood (Prolly 15 homes) with ADT so you will more than likely not see me carrying it around my yard . ADT is not so the cops know someone broke in, it's for me and my parents to kill the fucker who broke in and give us an advantage.
$alvador
TD Member
That doesn't answer my question about what situation you'd imagine yourself to be in to need a handgun. Even if you're going to a high-crime area if someone is going to jack you at gunpoint they aren't going to flash their piece for you to see it before it's in your face, especially when they know it's a CCW state. If it's just some nebulous reason like "to give me a chance" then aren't you just giving the criminal at least the same amount of chance to take your gun away from you? That's not to even mention the time lag associated with assessing the situation before drawing which a criminal has already done before you would even start to react.
So therefore I'm super curious about what situation you imagine you'd be in, in public, where it would actually be a smart idea to pull out your gun. Also, you clearly assume I don't know jack about guns or criminals which is the complete opposite of the truth. The reason I'm arguing against CCW is because I know the criminal still has the upper hand in the vast majority of situations they are likely to engage a civilian in.
So therefore I'm super curious about what situation you imagine you'd be in, in public, where it would actually be a smart idea to pull out your gun. Also, you clearly assume I don't know jack about guns or criminals which is the complete opposite of the truth. The reason I'm arguing against CCW is because I know the criminal still has the upper hand in the vast majority of situations they are likely to engage a civilian in.
excalibur
DARKLY Regular
I have pulled mine twice in the last 7 months. Once at a gas station when a guy was trying to rob the place. He decided his life was more important than the money when I pulled mine and yelled at him. The other time was on the street and a guy was waving his gun around threatening to kill another guy. Same thing he decided he would rather live.
Like I said the majority of the time YOU have the surprise. Criminals do not go after someone they know or think has a gun to rob they pick the unarmed.
Like I said the majority of the time YOU have the surprise. Criminals do not go after someone they know or think has a gun to rob they pick the unarmed.
swan
DARKLY Regular
man, where the fuck do you live? that's insane.
maybe guns aren't the problem so much as core societal issues that drive people to violence/crime. when we live in fear of each other, there is no trust, and the environment becomes hostile. when in a hostile environment the natural response is to become more hostile and aggressive yourself.
maybe we should spend more time building our communities and relationships with those around us. say "hi" to people walking down the street instead on treating everyone like an obstacle blocking your path type thing. love thy neighbour and all that, eh?
Fork Included
TD Admin
meanwhile in Canada..
scenario 1: you don't play Chuck Norris and let the cops handle it. You pulled the gun on some guy, were you ready to kill him? Were you ready to kill him faster than he was to kill you? How do you know he's not mental?
scenario 2: wouldn't happen because random fucks don't get the right to carry around guns, so the most a crazy man would be waving would be a pocket knife.
Your gun culture creates an environment where guns are used, plain and simple. Using that as a defence for gun ownership is weak. "everyone has a gun so i need to have a gun to keep everyone honest"
bullshit.
Fork Included
TD Admin
guns are the problem because they breed a culture of gun use
kids are taught from an early age that in america, if someone is fucking with you, you shove a gun in their face and "win" the argument.
conflict resolution through peaceful means?
preemptive conflict avoidance through social contracts?
appologizing for inappropriate behavior?
there is no "gun control argument"
there is only the sad truth that the vast majority of americans simply don't want to accept change. They don't want to accept the radical solution. They don't think it will work, so they refuse to try.
The argument has long ago been "lost," but no one wants to opennly accept it, so you have these threads pop up once in awhile.
jakksilves
LiR
I think Wrath is the only sane person here who's made an arguable...argument. The amount of publicity over gun control is outstanding, and it's not helping. Why change something that worked a few years ago and dozens of years ago before that? This 'fad' will hopefully pass soon out of congress's tight butthole like MLP is dying off from over aged and over-raged nerds.
swan
DARKLY Regular
and accept that we all need guns all the time to be safe and that's the only way it will work?
edit: also, we need to stop thinking about this as an argument. that only leads to the mentality of small children, "I'M RIGHT!" "NO I'M RIGHT!" "NO I'M RIGHT!" "YOU'RE DUMB I DON'T LIKE YOU ANYMORE!" ETC....
we need to look at this as a critical analysis of:
- what the situation is
- what we want in terms of long term goals
- what short term goals can get us there
it needs to be an open conversation will all sides willing to listen to and consider everyone else's opinions, without brushing them off because they don't fit our personal ideologies. progress requires compromise.
Fork Included
TD Admin
i'm sure steve (and everyone else) will try to disarm a situation through nonviolent means, but the effort and sencerity will be low. Talking is just a back-up plan for gun-slinging.